OUTTAKES

We have our offense for next year. We have the starting line, three TEs, all of our WRs, and Dillon, Ervin, and Dexter in the backfield with Rodgers.

As regards weapons, we have enough weapons to be the #1 offense in the league. More weapons is just gilding the lilly.

The defense, despite the drumbeat from people who can't tell a decent defense from a bad one, has been average-ish in most categories. It'll probably finish about #10 or #11 in scoring defense, just behind last year's #9 finish. That doesn't mean they've been above average on every play. Hell, Brett Favre was an HOFer but that doesn't mean he didn't have plays where he didn't look like one.

But over the course of the season, the defense has held half our opponents to 21 or less and at home it's only giving up about 22/game. And people think that we should fire Pettine? Clueless, truly.

Dolphins won their Super-bowls with the “no name” defense.

About this quote ... "In today's NFL, you can win a Super Bowl with an elite offense and a defense that is just okay" ...

Does the author have access to the internet?

If so, he might want to look up the FACT that every Super Bowl Champ since 2011 has finished in the top 10 when it comes to scoring defense.

With all the resources the Pack have devoted to the D their D should be a top 10 unit.

It is not.

I'll go to Vegas with the if Pettine isn't going anywhere prop, then the Packers will not be going anywhere near a SB.
Dom gave the Pack the last SB. I went to the final game @ Lambeau vs the Bears to get in the dance. The D drove that win and the string through
Philly and Atlanta. Hell, even the Bear game. Nick Collins with the pick six.

Reviewing the SB Game, the KC defense got the key stops in the second half to get the ball back in Mahomes hands to propel the win. If they fold, Garoppolo would have been the MVP.

I might catch some flack for this but IMO the offense had a lot to do with the loss in the NFC finals. Yes, they made it to the NFC finals with that very defense. They just ran up against a better team. SF offense last year reminds me of GBs offense this year. They put points up on any team regardless of its defensive rating.

When the O sputtered it put an onus on the D, it was over. No defense was going to hold them and certainly not GB's with all the issues they had and still have to some extent.

Packers scored last year much like teams score against the Packers this year. Against a prevent Defense.

PS - I think the author makes the point about the shift in rules that have led it to be a much more offense driven league so while I see the points made on the Packers D and many are legit the probability of winning w/o a top D has certainly been increased.

It's not a all or nothing scenario it's simply a shift in weighted importance. If the packers play terrib;e D they will go nowhere. Of they play to the level they have shown less peaks and valleys they have a good chance. Its why they play the games, as they say.

Last week alone proves nothing, I agree. Bad O line and poor QB playing catch up, so we never really had to deal with consistent running plays against us. That combines to make it a pretty favorable match up for our D.

If it returns out to be a trend, great, but at this point it’s just as likely to be our last opponent.

I have a simple theory that has been proven to apply to all teams less the occasional deviance.

Defenses play better against weaker offenses. Injuries, match-ups and human factors are all variables. So tough to argue that the D should of done better than the norm last week. I thought they did and helped keep the team in the game when the O only scored 10pts.

To be fair it works both ways so when they play teams with good QBs/RBs/Offenses no one should be expecting the best stats. Tampa,Mnn and Indy are all good offenses.

Losing Green didn't help, neither did losing Winn. Also the authors silly notion that essentially defense doesn't matter in winning a super bowl is just ridiculous. All it's going to take is the version of defense that last faced the Vikings, and this will be over.

In 2011, one of the most prolific offenses in NFL history couldn't overcome the hideous defense Capers and Thompson fielded that year, and is the perfect example of how and why history will likely repeat itself.

This team is fun to watch when it's dismantling mediocre football teams, but the Bucs and Viking losses loom as a large indicator of what happens when your defense is "This Defense". There are no Bums in the playoffs, you're needing to make a run at the best teams, the most balanced teams in the NFL.

Been saying it all year, just like I did in 2011, this team won't go deep in the playoffs.

Final word, still a very entertaining Packers team to watch play, they're in virtually every game. They have some sloppy Special Teams play to resolve, but they're at least fun to watch..

What.....EVEN Lombardi, Wolf knew?????????
But its on me, how can I still read your stuff.

Love could be very well the answer, if we need him some day. And when a pretty solid contra indicator like you said otherwise, we can not be in a better place.

Tend to agree with your theme, but Rodgers isn't going anywhere else unless he wants to.

He likes veteran players for a reason. A great article in The Sporting News, years ago, print edition with interviews of Bill and Jim Johnson. Both echoed this theme: they wanted intelligent players preferably with leadership skills ( as in College team Captains) who were football players. The NFL demands decisions to be made and executed in a matter of seconds. By football players, they meant people to be in position to make the tackle or create the turnover. The name of the game is to control the piece of leather. The philosophy of retreat gives you a defense that never showed in the NFCCH game.

Secondly, You may be referring to sherman throwing Ed Donatelle under the bus for the 4th and 26 play. Donatelle had pressure called and sherman had overidden the call to go soft, prevent. The series of failed calls after he chose not to go for it on 4th and one with supposedly the best O line in the league and Ahman Green who could run through a wall; Larry Beightol was furious and called him out later. With Donatelle, the Pack always had DBs playing the ball and picking off passes and LBs stripping for fumbles.
Still one of the worst moves in Packer History when Wolf set that guy up to be the HC.

You nailed it. If it looks and walks like a duck, it’s a duck

"Most of us see the problem with our own eyes -- a soft and disorganized and ineffectual defense that never seems to make substantial changes or adjustments or improvements."

Uh-Oh, you should be hearing from someone who fancies himself as a Clint Eastwood movie title for daring to use your eyes and not stats only.

"Anybody, please let me know why you are confident in our defense to go forward in a way that is pleasing to you, and worthy of all of us as loyal and savvy fans of the Packers?"

I'm not part of this group, but allow to me to offer the basis of their thinking. It's all about stats and rankings for them.

In the movie Shooter, with Mark Wahlberg, his FBI agent partner says to his boss, 'Maybe I should wait for the report to come out, read it, and then remember what I saw.'

This I fear is a custom for some here, as the only speak they seem to know is that of stats and rankings.

I agree with your post.

Agree 100%, the Packer D is undisciplined, soft, and demonstrate piss poor tackling fundamentals.

Heeeee crybabies, dramaqueens, armchair wannebeeees. Just try the new Colin Kaepernick icecream. Comes out today. So you can relax a little bit. Good time ahead. D gets better, can be good enought.
Someday you can even try to read and maybe even understand a statistic. But be carefull, its something like science......
But I give you the "insult to our intelligences", That was a good one. Really good one.

A 9 to 3 team (with some great football) in a season most of you dramaqueens thought would not start at all is good enough for me all the time. With the NFC north wraped up already and a chance for the NFC nr.1. The orange prisoner would say "the best season ever, of all time, since they pump up the footballs, that human mankind ever saw . Even in the my parallel universe".

Swisch couldn’t have said it better, poetry my boy ha

They're young and getting better.
Unlike a guy like you who doesn't understand either the game of football, the way modern offenses and defenses operate in a time of massive change, or the growth and development curves of players, I am a former athlete who respects the process, knows that the scheme is sound, and trusts in the GM to get good players and for them to ultimately become comfortable in that scheme.

It doesn't happen overnight.

There's no talent gap. There's no coaching gap. The D isn't soft, weak, undisciplined or lacking in athletes.

You simply don't understand it when mistakes are made or when the other team makes good plays and you certainly don't know the scheme or assignments to the point that you can assess it or lay blame.

You're just another idiot mouthing off about things you don't understand. You are the one who is crazy and the D is getting better and is peaking at the right time and is good enough to win the Super Bowl.

It's not an illusion. ALL of the good defenses are coming back to the mean right now as they play bad teams, and the Packer D, which has mostly faced GREAT offenses, is also coming back to the mean with good performances against weaker teams.

And that's how it works for everyone.

"Seeing the problem with your own eyes" leads to inaccurate conclusions; as opposed to incorporating data into the opinion you are forming from what you see. Science deniers are the people who eschew facts.

If we operated solely under the eye test we would still believe that the earth is flat. Of course, we do have an unfortunate part of the population, such as Taryn, who believes that the dinosaurs and humans existed together.

One thinks statistics have come a long way since Mark Twain. Though your point is taken. Statistics are just a tool and if it's the right tool and a quality tool great, if it's the wrong tool or not a quality tool it most likely just makes things worse. Statistics should always be used in conjunction with observations. In Many instances statistics are derived from observations. There are reasons Sports teams and really most businesses rely so much more on statistics, when used correctly they give you a huge advantage.

Poker is a fantastic example of that, when probability/statistics were implemented at a higher level by the young guns they really took over the game. The guys who didn't adapt were left behind, most likely broke. These veterans observed thousands of hands but w/o statistics to provide perspective/probability and roi figures its not a robust enough process.

Statistics can say two different things when quantifying a single performance, that is very true. People can observe the same thing and have two completely different opinions as well.

Anytime one goes to an extreme you lose, those that can determine the correct balance and be using the best stats and human element will come out on top.

I miss the days of simplicity but with so much information now available if its your neck on the line you can't afford to be so complacent.

Maybe it was just him and Rex.

I honestly don't see the problem with the players communicating with their coaches regarding what schemes and plays they're most comfortable running. My guess is this happens with every functional team every year. In the off-season we'll probably read all about how MLF and Rodger's relationship and communication took the offense to new heights... I just think the firw the coaches crowd are blowing up this innocuous tidbit to advance the narrative that Pettine is clueless.

That said, I agree that Pettine's future likely depends upon if there's an embarrassing defensive display in the playoffs. I'm ok with that!

Really, the perception is Petinne had it wrong but the players straightened him out? Thats not a serious argument. What evidence does one have that these were changes that drove a sustained improvement. What exactly were the changes? how often were they used? what was the specific result? Is it the only variable that impacted the change. Or does ones just think they know more than anyone w/o knowing and detailed information.
Heck, Much talk has been around how last weeks improvement was driven by the weakness of the opponents offensive line as well as the score being so close later into the game. If the statement is meant to be funny I get it, the reply response really was but the idea that the players are smarter than the coach is just silly, and if serious one must have a great sense of themselves having football knowledge above and beyond the professionals to make it.

Sp teams starts with the GM getting bad ass players and some speed. The Head Coach has to set the tone if things go awry and make changes in season to the scheme. No time for reassessment when the season is over.
LeFleur has to straighten this bullshit out, now.

"Mikey PP? Wow, that is really mature. Is it possible for you to make a point that does not contain a reference to a bodily function?

I'm having a hard time getting on board with your convictions. Perhaps an example would help me? Which Superbowl winning team in the history of the NFL had a front office dictate to the head coach to fire a coordinator midseason when they were in 2nd place in the conference? Thats what you need to see happen in order to convince you the front office wants to win, instead of just build theme parks, right? Geesh...

Kickoffs have practically disappeared and with teams moving the ball so well and also going for it more often on 4th down means punts are far less frequent than they used to be.
Special teams don't really affect the overall outcome in most games--Pack still won easily when they made their huge mistakes--and those mistakes, giving up the big play or having such a bad punting day that field position is an issue, hardly ever happen as well.

The Pack have been crap on ST. It simply doesn't matter.

Teddy Bridgewater could not hit a guy wide open in the endzone on a four yard pass vs the queens. Not worried about Carolina. Detroit could set up for a shoot out. They have nothing to lose and Bevell knows the Pack's weaknesses. CMIII is 34 years old, hanging in the LA sun and raising a family. If he wanted to play, he would be on a team from day one. Gutedkunst did not draft those stiffs.

The last four SB winners ran four man fronts.

That would indicate the players are not that good to begin with and when someone shows ability, Pettine does not give them reps.

Mediocrity says you're not a winner or loser. It's a safe space from which both can argue or cry a defense of mediocrity. Also know as statistic and ranking adorers.