Let's Talk Football: When your offense falls apart
Aaron chats with Andy about the Packers Wild Card playoff loss to the Eagles and what it means going forward as the Packers head into the offseason.
By PackerAaron
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Comments (36)
Bear
January 13, 2025 at 02:50 pm
Things that bother me regarding the current Packers.
Lack of play design or personnel not being able to separate from the defenders. Is this because of a poor offensive coordinator?
Offensive linemen appear to not be developing. Is this because of poor Offensive Line coaching?
Seems to be a need for a consistent clutch receiver!
I would like to see more qualified Offensive Line Coach & Offensive Coordinator.
cdoemel
January 13, 2025 at 08:21 pm
The Packers have a top 10 Oline in the league by several sources. Josh Myers is the weak link.
cdoemel
January 13, 2025 at 08:24 pm
And the Packers gave up the 2nd fewest amount of sacks in the NFL. The O line is the least of their worries, tho adding depth is always important. Having Jordan Morgan healthy next year will be good.
Oppy
January 14, 2025 at 02:13 am
The Packers gave up the 2nd fewest sacks, but they also were 30th in the league in passing attempts.
The less you pass, the less opportunity there are for sacks.
Sacks aren't a good metric for gauging OL play by itself, and I'll tell you why. You don't tally a sack unless the QB gets sacked. Seems obvious, right? Here's the thing- when the QB gets sacked, it doesn't get tallied as a Hit or a Hurry, either.
So, if you are going to rely on stats to get an idea of how well your OL is performing, what you really need to do to even start to get an idea of how well the OL is pass protecting, is do this calculation:
(Sacks allowed + QB Hits allowed + QB Hurries allowed) / Total Passing Attempts
That'll give you a statistic we could call "pressure allowed percentage".
When you start really looking at the metrics, you'd find the Packers OL was probably closer to the 13th best pass blocking OL. That's pretty good, but it's not nearly as good as "they gave up the 2nd fewest amount of sacks in the NFL" sounds. Love is elusive in the pocket, a decent scrambler, and he's strong. He also gets the ball out of his hands before taking most would be sacks. When you look at the total of all pressures, you start to realize the Packers weren't an elite pass blocking unit in 2024. They're just outside the top 1/3rd.
sugarbair
January 14, 2025 at 09:15 am
I agree. The O-Line needs some attention. More than just a new center.
bleedgreen
January 14, 2025 at 11:11 am
Sounds like Mike Wahle feels it is bad coaching. Lets hire him.
bjkdad44
January 13, 2025 at 10:20 pm
I believe it IS poor coaching…
Celise...
January 13, 2025 at 03:25 pm
i feel like matt lafleur is a smart coach, however, i don't feel like he is very wise! there is a difference between knowing something and being able to communicate that to someone else. if the players don't fully grasp what is being taught, it is going to slow down the performance on the field. jordan may come off like he's all cool under pressure, but his play screams otherwise. they want him to throw fewer int's, as he should, but at what cost? jordan clearly does not have a feel for where his receiving corp is out on the field during plays...so he looks down field and neglects the harder to see open man 10 yds out on the periphery. sometimes over thinking in football is a kiss of death. btw...i believe that was joe barrys problem as well... trying to run something that takes players to long to learn. my guess is they've (the coaches) taken years to learn what they know but players don't have years to learn, they get replaced to quickly, so they're going to do what they feel most comfortable doing.
SicSemperTyrannis
January 13, 2025 at 05:56 pm
In terms of the Iggles, going to TEs more was the obvious answer for so many reasons. My big fear was with #88 they'd put too much on tape of both him and 85 on the field at the same time. No worries there but MAN was that needed last night and MLF just never called it.
Gotta fool opponents with run vs pass, you guys covered that well. It's STILL like MLF doesn't know what to do with a successful run game even after he handed that part over to Steno.
This is a winning defense, just add one top tier CB; I think that can be found in round one of the draft. It's an effective lineman you need to go to FA for. Unfortunately we need at least one on both sides of the ball. I think one top talent at WR to draft and develop might be ok and doesn't require a FA?
dobber
January 14, 2025 at 08:23 am
"going to TEs more was the obvious answer for so many reasons. My big fear was with #88 they'd put too much on tape of both him and 85 on the field at the same time."
I was disappointed that they didn't do the 2 TE looks more. They seemed to shrink away from it compared to recent games. I thought 88 was a natural--esp. in the run game--to take up some of Watson's snaps. Instead, they went deeper into the WR rotation.
I would say that at this stage you can't worry about putting things on film anymore. It's one and done. Any of those saved looks aren't doing them any good now.
"This is a winning defense, just add one top tier CB; I think that can be found in round one of the draft. It's an effective lineman you need to go to FA for"
My understanding is that this is a better DL/Edge draft than CB draft (I'll let others weigh in on that). Watson's injury really muddies things up some, but depending on flow of the draft, I'm hoping for OL/DL/CB (in no particular order) in the first two days. This might be a trade-back year to get more capital in the first 3 rounds. They need some bodies.
I agree: they're going to need to fill in FA.
cdoemel
January 13, 2025 at 08:41 pm
We’ll have Jordan Morgan back healthy next year. Definitely need to draft a CB. Would be nice to pick up a veteran WR (which I was against until these last three games) and Maxx Crosby
pacman
January 13, 2025 at 08:47 pm
Q1: why do they "have all the confidence" in JL (and MLF for that matter)?
"MLF has to make it easier on JL" - what does that mean? Is it MLF's fault that he mostly underthrows his deep WR's? Many of his passes are not placed great or out of reach?
Q2: "Looking for someone disruptive upfront on D". You mean Clark and Gary are not those guys? How did they go from great to average this season?
bjkdad44
January 13, 2025 at 10:22 pm
I’d like for someone to please answer that last question…?!
sugarbair
January 14, 2025 at 09:21 am
$$$$$$
FumundaStank
January 14, 2025 at 11:27 am
Gary has never been great. He's way over paid for what he provides. Clark has had his moments. The problem is even when he was playing good, he would go into hibernation for extended periods of time. He's another over paid player for what he provides and should not have been signed to his recent extension. The Packers just don't seem to learn with these guys. The Packers love to over pay them because they are "our guys".
Coldworld
January 14, 2025 at 10:33 am
At DL, do we need a run stuffer? Slaton is a FA. What are we asking of DTs. Wyatt is a penetrator. He wasn’t used much outside obvious rush downs. Part of that may be injury, but Wyatt wasn’t a plus in the run game. Conversely Slaton was barely used in passing situations. What are we asking of Clark and what would we therefore be looking for?
At DE, we need a different trick. Ignoring salary/value considerations, Gary is our best Power/burst player. Everyone else is essentially less athletic version of that or Van Ness, who seems neither powerful enough or agile enough to be that or a speed threat.
We obviously need at least one other power type behind Gary, but we need to add one maybe two that are speed/agility options. That will mean moving on from one or two by trade or release. Simply too much of the same and they have to adapt to Hafley’s D.
Lphill
January 13, 2025 at 08:56 pm
Everyone giving Love a free pass, he has been awful last few games , he may not be the guy we think he is.
dobber
January 14, 2025 at 08:25 am
"Everyone giving Love a free pass, "
You're clearly not paying attention.
Packerpasty
January 14, 2025 at 01:09 pm
good one!! He must not be..
stanthemanwiththeplan
January 14, 2025 at 05:02 pm
you are literally defending him right now..
Tundraboy
January 13, 2025 at 09:13 pm
As good as the Oline is on paper, it's not up to the task in the playoffs. I mean Hurts really. He's got so much padding on him and he can barely see over the line and the only reason they win with him is because nobody ever gets to him and for now he can still run. But his bell has been rung too often. Anyway I digress. That's what they need to give to Love, an impenetrable line. One that pushes people around.
Then let's see what he can do.
canadapacker
January 13, 2025 at 10:54 pm
That's been the Packers mantra. Probably not a bad idea because we have a running back who seldom gets stopped by the first guy. The old zone blocking scheme but we do have the pieces and obviously need to add more and move on from some.
dobber
January 14, 2025 at 08:27 am
"As good as the Oline is on paper, it's not up to the task in the playoffs."
The depth just isn't there right now. They suffered one starter injury (Morgan) and were pretty lucky after that to not need someone like Dillard or Glover or Telfort to play 3-4 games.
It seems a given that Myers will walk, which means that even if Morgan comes back, the OL is exactly 5 deep. They desperately need someone (Glover/Monk/Jennings) to make big strides this off-season to take some pressure off the draft. That should be worrisome.
Bitternotsour
January 14, 2025 at 08:56 am
weirdly enough I think Myers injury increases the likelihood he returns. His options are probably very limited now, I wouldn't be surprised at all that he comes back on a 1 year prove-it type deal.
also, that the back-ups weren't ready for playoff football doesn't mean they won't ever be ready for playoff football. my bigger concern is if MLF will ever be ready for playoff football.
dobber
January 14, 2025 at 10:17 am
Yeah, an injury that requires several months of rehab would have been a problem. I haven't heard a final diagnosis, but it seems he avoided any of that. I find myself wondering if the Packers would go down that road.
"also, that the back-ups weren't ready for playoff football doesn't mean they won't ever be ready for playoff football. "
Absolutely, but they need a pretty significant step up to move the needle. Admittedly, Philly has a talented D.
Tundraboy
January 14, 2025 at 03:25 pm
Yes need to have more than 5. I've come to realize that is the one area where we need to catch a break. Seems to be one step forward and two back. Fingers crossed as always.
canadapacker
January 13, 2025 at 10:18 pm
Anybody watching the vikes performance? Think that they will keep Darnold? What a lousy QB - I mean 2 bad games in a row. You get my point PEOPLE - bad games happen - bad Oline performances happen - and Darnold had his receivers healthy which we didnt.
dobber
January 14, 2025 at 08:29 am
I think Darnold just got sacked again.
Bitternotsour
January 14, 2025 at 08:59 am
he won 14 games, and then he froze in the headlights. Minnesota has a big set of decisions to make. I still think someone pays Darnold. The Bears for example would have been a lot better with him under center than their mistake selection at number one.
dobber
January 14, 2025 at 10:23 am
This is almost Case Keenum all over again.
I think the Vikes will let him walk, yes, take the comp pick, and roll with the guy on the rookie deal. I don't personally think McCarthy is a great bet, but if the OL plays well and they can keep the pass-catchers healthy you could stake up a cut-out of SpongeBob back there and he'd throw for 250.
I think that Williams is salvageable for Chicago, which is why I'm watching who they hire as a HC. They make bad decisions in general, but I think he's more talented than a guy like Goff.
Coldworld
January 14, 2025 at 10:37 am
They got to Darnold. That’s always been the secret. The difference is that the Rams had the ability to make that happen. Once they did the results were exactly as expected. The Vikings OL isn’t as good as Detroit’s but it was good enough for us and the regular season.
GreenAndGold_1963
January 13, 2025 at 10:44 pm
MLF is supposed to be an offensive guru… but there isn’t any creative play calling. It’s his responsibility to get the players back in the game when the offense is struggling. I don’t see it. He is too predictable and too slow to make adjustments. Of course JL is just as responsible as MLF.
albert999
January 13, 2025 at 11:58 pm
Play calling play calling play calling
How the hell didn’t you touch on that?
albert999
January 14, 2025 at 12:00 am
Love and laflower both are not Super Bowl caliber
Dump now
bleedgreen
January 14, 2025 at 11:17 am
Don't think they can dump him realistically. They need to try and make him better. Hopefully he turns into a top 15 qb. If not we are in trouble. Should have waited him out a year and franchised if necessary.
NJ-RICK
January 14, 2025 at 08:30 am
DEFENSE DEFENSE PASS RUSH PASS RUSH.... The Packers need physical aggressive defensive play makers. Offense and Defensive lines need major upgrade. It all starts up front with MGT. Gute has a poor draft record and Free agents acquisitions. Time for changes at the MGT level...