Hello Wisconsin: Perceived Strengths and Weaknesses in the Packers’ Initial 53-Man Roster
With the Packers having made their final roster cuts, it's time to evaluate their depth.
By TimBackes
The Green Bay Packers finally made the cuts to get down to the required maximum of 53 men on their roster on Tuesday afternoon. As always, there were a few minor surprises, but for the most part the list looks as most people would have expected it to.
With that list still fresh in our minds, I wanted to start today’s column not by examining why the Packers made the choices they did to get to 53, but instead touching on what I now perceive to be the team’s biggest areas of strength and weakness.
Let’s take a look.
STRENGTHS
How long has it been since defensive line AND edge rusher were both areas of strength and depth? It felt like for years the Packers ignored the defensive line entirely, and that rarely did the Packers have more than two or three edge rushers who you felt comfortable with being on the field.
On the defensive line, you’ve got an all pro caliber player in Kenny Clark, but then you’ve also got guys like TJ Slaton and Devonte Wyatt, who have really looked like beasts in this preseason and saw some significant improvements toward the end of last season as well. Those three guys have a whole lot of beef along the front of the line, and even players like Karl Brooks and Colby Wooden have looked like solid rotational players.
At the edge, you’ve got the headliners in Rashan Gary and Preston Smith. Meanwhile, Kingsley Enagbare has been on fire; the guy looks like a future starter in this league. Lukas Van Ness is going to be on the Rashan Gary growth plan, which is absolutely fine–he has all the physical tools to be a stud, but it’s going to take him a bit to get to that point. Brenton Cox has been the surprise of training camp. He’s been out there making plays left and right, and could force the coaches to get him in the game more frequently.
Other quick areas of strength: the Packers are four deep with solid corners, have two strong running backs (and one with promise), and have depth ALL OVER the offensive line. They kept 11 guys on the line for a reason–they felt like they couldn’t let any of them go. It’s great to see Sean Rhyan coming along after a disappointing rookie campaign, and with Yosh Nijman might be your fourth-best tackle, it’s an embarrassment of riches.
WEAKNESSES
Obviously, the number one area of concern is safety. The Packers do not have any real bona fide starters at the position, unless Darnell Savage suddenly returns to 2020 form. There are a bunch of guys just kind of floating around at that position who will probably take turns getting cracks at a role in the defensive backfield, but none of them really inspire a whole lot of confidence.
You’ve got to be concerned about the kicker. Anders Carlson made a couple big kicks in games, but he’s also struggled mightily throughout camp. In a year where the Packers seem content to accept some growing pains, it certainly seems as though they’re willing to let Carlson work through his struggles. But if the wins actually start piling up in a bigger way than expected, you’ve got to wonder whether they’ll regret the decision in a big-game situation.
I think the Packers are going to be just fine at wide receiver and tight end, but it’s worth pointing out that I don’t know if there’s ever been a unit of pass catchers with as little experience as this one. Christian Watson, Romeo Doubs and Samori Toure have the most experience of the wide receivers in their second years, and Josiah Deguara is the only tight end with NFL experience. There’s a ton of talent here at these positions, but it’s hard to know what to expect from guys who are so young. It may take a bit for them to gel in the offense.
Those are what I see as the team’s biggest areas of positional strength and weakness heading into the season. What are your thoughts?
Wisconsin Beer of the Week
Summer is coming to an end, meaning that when the calendar turns to September tomorrow it will be officially time for Oktoberfest beers, pumpkin ales, a greater variety of stouts and porters, and so much more.
So as an ode to the end of the summer, I wanted to feature a light, crisp helles lager that you can find pretty much anywhere in Wisconsin. It’s by one of Wisconsin’s best breweries, Central Waters Brewing Company, and it’s their Tomorrow River Helles.
Here’s the description from the brewery:
“When pints of lager are ordered at pubs around Europe, this is the style that is often slid across the bar. Light, malty, and with just enough floral hops to bring it all into balance. Brewed with Hallertau hops and MaltGems Synergy Pilsner malt from Briess Malting.”
It’s basically a classic German-style lager, and it goes down so smoothly on a hot summer’s day (or any time, really).
Central Waters is known perhaps mostly for its barrel aging. I’ve seen the facility and it’s tremendous. But they’ve got a great selection of other beers as well, and their flagships (which include the helles) are available in liquor stores all over Wisconsin, and even a bit beyond. Give ‘em a shot, you won’t regret it!
A big season for Brian Gutekunst and Matt LaFleur
We’ve been talking a lot about the huge opportunity that awaits the Packers’ younger players this year, who will be able to grow and gel together throughout the coming months. But this is also a really big season for Brian Gutekunst and Matt LaFleur.
For the last several years, critics of LaFleur and Gutekunst have said that the Packers’ success was due to Aaron Rodgers, and that LaFleur and Gutekunst were simply riding his coattails. It is, almost certainly, one of the biggest reasons LaFleur did not win a Coach of the Year award during his 2019-2021 stretch.
If the Packers end up looking good this season, and especially if they push for a playoff spot, the narrative around these guys is going to start to switch. I’d venture to say most Packer fans would generally approve of the job they have done, even if they have some criticisms. But even some of the naysayers would have to admit it would be a pretty impressive bounceback with a new franchise quarterback and a young roster.
Around the NFC North
As always, it’s time to go around the NFC North.
- The CHICAGO BEARS will be coming into week one at full force against the Packers, other than the ailing Teven Jenkins on the offensive line. With the Packers being healthy as well, it will be a great opportunity for these teams to stack themselves up against each other. There will be no excuses for defeat; whoever comes out the winner will be able to make an early statement in the NFC North. THe question then becomes which team has the better matchups. We’ll analyze that in more detail next week.
- The DETROIT LIONS ended up keeping only two running backs, despite having had some significant success on the ground a year ago. But with Jamaal Williams gone ands ome of the new faces failing to make an impression, the Lions are sticking with veteran David Montgomery and the 12th overall pick Jahmyr Gibbs. Their wide receiver position is going to be in flux in the absence of Jameson Williams, who is out for at least the first several weeks due to a gambling suspension, so they’re going to really be relying on Amon-Ra St. Brown to carry the unit in his absence. Marvin Jones is a capable veteran but is getting up there in age, and likely will not be relied upon in the passing game to the extent Williams would be.
- The MINNESOTA VIKINGS are reportedly attempting to lock in a contract extension with Justin Jefferson before the regular season begins. Jefferson, who may be the finest player in the NFL not named Patrick Mahomes, represents the only true blue-chip player the Vikings have, which could make for a long year for this team. There is a significant talent deficit between Jefferson and everyone else on the team. Danielle Hunter could be considered a star player if he’s able to return to his pre-injury form. Otherwise, this is a team that is going to be getting close to a rebuild. They’ve got an aging and mid-tier quarterback, a running game that is likely to be ineffective, a mid-tier offensive line at best, little help in the receiving corps beyond Jefferson, and a defense that was thoroughly exposed toward the end of the 2022 season.
65%
I’ve mostly avoided writing anything about Aaron Rodgers and the New York Jets in this space, because every time you raise the subject there are inevitably going to be people going “WHY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT AARON RODGERS HE’S NOT A PACKER ANY MORE MOVE ON GET OVER IT.”
But, with the year kicking off, I do find it worth restating one more time what exactly Packer fans should be paying attention to with Rodgers and the Jets this year.
As you almost certainly remember, the Packers received a second round draft pick from the Jets that could turn into a first round draft pick if Rodgers plays at least 65 percent of the Jets’ offensive snaps this year.
One would think that, if Rodgers stays healthy, this would be an extremely easy accomplishment. The only thing that could derail this, aside from health, is Rodgers being extremely terrible to the point that the Jets are noncompetitive for the entire season, which I don’t really see as a realistic possibility.
So essentially, Packer fans want to hope that:
- Rodgers stays healthy for the whole season, and
- The Jets are bad, so as to maximize the value of the first round draft pick, but not utterly hopeless to the point where Rodgers gets pulled during the season
There’s a lot of hype surrounding the Jets right now, and I can understand some of the excitement surrounding the defense, it’s difficult to see exactly what it is about the Jets’ offense aside from Rodgers that has people so interested and excited. Rodgers didn’t exactly play strong football a season ago, and several of the most noteworthy additions are Packers from a season ago. I mean, really, it feels like a version of the 2022 Packers.
I don’t really anticipate having any interest in watching the Jets this year, unlike the fascination I had with watching them under Brett Favre in 2008. But you better be sure I’ll be keeping tabs on Rodgers’ play time.
You’ve heard of “Christmas Creep,” but “Fall Creep” is also real
I alluded to this slightly already during my Wisconsin Beer of the Week section, but I am starting to get fall fatigue, and it’s not even September yet.
It feels as though every year, companies are desperate for fall to start earlier. We’re to the point now where breweries are putting Oktoberfest beers out in July, pumpkin spice everything is ubiquitous in early August, and fall-themed everything is everywhere long before Labor Day.
Christmas Creep has been a thing for quite some time, but it feels as though Fall Creep might be getting even worse. Just let us have our summer! Especially here in Wisconsin! We only get like three months of nice weather. Why are we in such a hurry to get to a time of year when everything is cold and dead?
Don’t get me wrong, I do enjoy fall. I love the smell of the leaves, the cooler weather, the food, the beer, the football, etc. But not to the point where I’m anxious for its arrival in July, when I’m still barely halfway through my summer.
So, this is my “bah humbug” moment of the column. Thank you for sticking with me.
“No one cares about your fantasy team!”
I needed to put in this disclaimer, because I’m about to talk about fantasy football.
At this point in my life I”m only playing in one league, and it’s the league I’ve been commissioning for well over a decade now. We had our draft on Monday evening, and I was in the ninth position for a 10-team league.
Being near the back end of the draft can turn out well, since you get to double up each time you pick. However, I noticed it was more of a struggle this year, because it felt as though there were fewer premium players to focus on than ever before.
I noticed that, for the first time that I can remember in all my years of playing fantasy football, there were two wide receivers as the top two players in the draft. In fact, approximately half of the top ranked players were at the wide receiver position. For many years, the rule was the top 10 was exclusively running backs, and you were a fool if you didn’t take a running back in the first round.
It just goes to show how much the game has changed over the years. Quarterbacks and wide receivers are now getting significantly more attention in fantasy due to how what’s being asked of them has changed.
For example, I took Lamar Jackson fairly early on in the draft. For years, I never would have taken a quarterback before, like the 7th round. But now, Jackson is well worth the draft considering his running propensity and how much of the Ravens’ offense he accounts for.
I’ve been playing fantasy football for a little over 20 years at this point, and while many things have stayed the same, it certainly feels as though you need to be more in-tune than ever with what other teams’ offenses look like, because you have fewer every-down backs than ever, and more committees in the RB and pass catching rooms.
Storylines I’m watching in the NFL this season
So aside from the 65 percent statistic with the New York Jets this year, what are some of the other biggest storylines or points of interest I’m watching around the league this year?
- The AFC triangle of elite quarterbacks (Chiefs/Mahomes, BIlls/Allen, Bengals/Burrow) is going to be an absolute blast to watch for, hopefully, many years to come. Every game that occurs between these teams is going to have massive playoff implications and could quite well represent the best football played in the NFL this season. I’m very much looking forward to those games and the impact they could have on the playoff race, and eventually, the playoffs themselves.
- The NFC remains pretty wide open, as it has sort of felt for the last couple years. Who’s going to be able to step up and take it? It really feels like the Eagles remain quite separate from the rest of the pack. Will the 49ers be back near the top? Who else is going to look even semi-capable of contending? Is the entire conference about to lie down for the AFC?
- The quarterback situation for the 49ers is fascinating to me. With Trey Lance traded to Dallas and Jimmy Garoppolo starting in Las Vegas, the 49ers have firmly committed themselves to Brock Purdy. But Purdy is coming off a significant elbow surgery, and only has about a half year of NFL football under his belt as Mr. Irrelevant. Is he actually going to be a legitimate starting quarterback in this league? What happens if the 49ers committed to the wrong guy, or simply find out that he’s not going to be able to come back from his injury in the way they hoped?
- I’m still interested in watching Davante Adams and how he plays, as he’s starting to push Hall of Fame numbers. It just got a little harder in swapping out Derek Carr for the slightly worse Jimmy G., but considering he was basically a thousand yard receiver with Brett Hundley, he’s certainly capable of continuing his torrid pace of statistical dominance.
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Tim Backes is a lifelong Packer fan and a contributor to CheeseheadTV. Follow him on Twitter @timbackes for his Packer takes, random musings and Untappd beer check-ins.
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Comments (108)
jeremyjjbrown
August 31, 2023 at 06:27 am
You know a position group is bad when the best player at the position is only on the team because their dead cap is too high.
TKWorldWide
August 31, 2023 at 07:26 am
It will be very interesting to see how Brian Branch does this season (and we’ll get an up-close view, twice) since GB definitely passed on him in the draft. Another way to look at it would be, would you trade Musgrave or Reed for him? And since Musgrave is a rookie at a tough position, it will probably take more than one season to decide.
stockholder
August 31, 2023 at 07:42 am
He's already the talk of the Lions Camp.
They can't believe he was there.
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 09:46 am
Then you know how bad their defense was in 2022.
Coldworld
August 31, 2023 at 08:11 am
Branch is playing exclusively in the slot, which is where he best projected to. We needed a true safety or two in a seemingly very weak group. We could still have done better later. I will be very surprised (and so will his former teams) if Anderson helps.
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 09:21 am
Branch does lack speed. Gutekunst is always thinking years out. Next year's draft class could offer exactly what they want for upgrades at the position, and burning an R2 on Branch may have not balanced their scales with both Musgrave and Reed staring at them.
They made their choice quite clear, and this was never going to be a one year fix.
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 09:46 am
Well, they went the route of the one-year fix THIS year...
jeremyjjbrown
August 31, 2023 at 10:23 am
I agree, build around Love now. Safety can be added later.
LLCHESTY
August 31, 2023 at 02:52 pm
There was enough day 3 picks where Gutey could have pulled a Moore, MVS and ESB type draft and grabbed 3 of them. I guess the consolation is the round 4-6 picks look like contributors.
HawkPacker
August 31, 2023 at 07:58 pm
Yeah, if the talent is not there, it is not there!
T7Steve
August 31, 2023 at 06:58 am
"The Packers do not have any real bona fide starters at the position, unless Darnell Savage suddenly returns to 2020 form."
Just like the O-linemen are the QBs best friend, the D-linemen are the safeties best friend. Lucky that's one of the strengths you mentioned, Tim. Last season Joe B. let the DBs get exposed and didn't want to play to their strengths till it was too late. Even Amos had a sub-par season, and I really liked him.
I'm a little worried about the slot corner getting gashed in the middle of the field. I don't see that as much of a strength as you, Tim. Then again, a savage and relentless pass rush and a line that frees up the ILBs can work magic.
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 08:45 am
They have the bodies in the front 7 to play much more aggressively at the LOS than they have in the past. It's a group that should be making plays in the opponent's backfield with regularity. JB is the real question: is he smart enough to use those guys?...to put them in positions to succeed?
LLCHESTY
August 31, 2023 at 02:59 pm
They were pretty aggressive with the stunts this preseason(especially for preseason!). Hopefully that wasn't a pysche out and they go back to the boring Barry gap and a half looks.
https://twitter.com/BenFennell_NFL/status/1696906713109090669?t=FBqYCfuk...
TKWorldWide
August 31, 2023 at 07:11 am
Savage’s decline is really puzzling. How can a guy regress after year one? Attitude? Intensity? Change of scheme?
I cringed when Pettine said something along the lines of “adequate vs the run, strong vs the pass”. For the last several years, GB has been far short of “adequate” vs the run, and we’ve seen how the opposing offense constantly being in favorable down and distances can hamstring a defense. D-linemen generally take time to develop, so with Wyatt and Slaton showing the expected progress as young players, there is promise here.
Let the young receivers and tight ends play and develop. They’ve got the luxury to learn and grow this year without the heavy SB pressure of the last few years.
Razer
August 31, 2023 at 08:09 am
...Savage’s decline is really puzzling...
For a while there we got enamoured with getting faster at the expense of getting smarter players. Ted and Brian's fixation with the RAS number didn't yield the smartest guys and this showed up in slow to react secondary and linebacker picks. I think Savage has trouble thinking the game and that is a big problem for a safety.
Coldworld
August 31, 2023 at 08:14 am
The Barry system has seen Savage regress and Amos, previously a rock. Barry asks safeties to be Woodsons—to do everything well. We don’t have a Woodson. That tends to make players play against strengths 50% of the time. Very few will thrive in that circumstance.
Razer
August 31, 2023 at 08:43 am
Joe Barry may be my biggest question mark going into this season. The Packers will compete this year but the defense has to be solid and the difference. I won't be happy if the players are disorganized and assignment unsure. Either you can coach a system or you can't. Show me Joe.
LambeauPlain
August 31, 2023 at 08:58 am
Barry has yet to experience a successful year as a DC after 6 tries. This will be his best opportunity to make 2023 his best season of success. Even being the #15 or 16 Defense in the NFL would be huge improvement...and a disappointment with 8 first rounders to coach...but it could be good enough to help log more wins vs losses.
Barryball has been designed to play passive defense with a lead. With the focus on the DL and a solid core of front 7 depth, this should foreshadow an attacking D forcing the O to react to it, not the other way around.
The shortest leash on the Packers should be attached to Barry's pinch collar.
jeremyjjbrown
August 31, 2023 at 10:25 am
Savage fell off a cliff once Barry arrived, that's one thing I know for sure.
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 12:34 pm
But what does it say that after he was benched last year and returned to the lineup he played better?
T7Steve
August 31, 2023 at 12:40 pm
Wasn't he moved primarily to the slot at that time to account for the Stokes' injury and Douglass not playing well in the slot? Didn't it also coincide with a more aggressive defense?
Don't know if that's just my memory, but he did seem to play well.
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 07:12 am
I think the elephant in the room is our roster holes.
Some dust remains floating & unsettled on the Packers roster, with CB, S and OL (Newman/Nijman?) moves further anticipated.
Roster holes are not necessarily a bad thing at this stage. Waiver claims can still be made. Players can be signed off other team’s Practice Squads. Trades might factor in here too.
The Packers do have the luxury of not having to jump right now. It’s a young team, yet not without strength, speed and talent.
Since most of our roster holes involve 2nd string players, the Packers might have taken a step back to let the dust settle, get a better evaluation of their options, and grab the best of the best available. Maybe they do some PS raiding.
Maybe they don’t have to… my top 2 targets for the Packers are still available. S Kendall Smith from Illinois & S/CB Keidron Smith, who played with Carrington Valentine at Kentucky.
The Packers having enquired about Jonathan Taylor points to more movement in the works than we may have thought. Maybe multiple players being moved off our current 53 via trade.
Extensions which might require some fast tracking to allow for trades is also a consideration.
TKWorldWide
August 31, 2023 at 07:22 am
Yes, and they already grabbed a tight end and a safety.
The churn is real!
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 08:54 am
It really is TK. We all expected churn! Well, here it is! LOL.
Ford was the surprise, but, none of us knows the staff's primary reason to release him. While I supported the pick from R7 2022, the size at NT, his pass rush up the middle, I have to admit he still got pushed out of the way in RUN STOP. At some point, if those issues remain after all of that coaching, you have to call it.
I'm trusting the process.
SicSemperTyrannis
August 31, 2023 at 01:37 pm
I'm expecting Jonathan Ford comes back, at least to the PS. Wooden and Brooks are not NT. Finding somebody actually better at it than Ford is ... unlikely.
LLCHESTY
August 31, 2023 at 03:05 pm
I thought Ford was secure on the 53 after watching Brooks get trucked at 2i two plays in a row against the Seahawks.
Hopefully he's brought up and active against the Bears. Right now Slaton is the 2nd best DT they have and not having Ford active limits Slaton's roles, besides not having a Clark-Ford-Slaton front of their getting gashed vs the run.
Savage57
August 31, 2023 at 07:18 am
Rodgers doesn't need to stay healthy the whole season. If he plays to schedule and can make it to about midway through the Jets 11th game, I'd be OK with seeing him taken off the field on a cart anytime after that.
T7Steve
August 31, 2023 at 07:29 am
No one wants to see anyone hurt! Wishing it is bad karma too. Defeated, Humiliated, ok (although I wish all ex-Packers well as long as they aren't playing the Packers).
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 12:35 pm
To be honest, I wouldn't have felt too bad if someone would've knocked Randy Moss' block off once or twice...
Leatherhead
August 31, 2023 at 12:42 pm
It is a moment of eternal shame when he pantomimed taking a crap in our endone and then wiping himself on our goal post....not one single Packer went over there and stopped him. He should have been given a Charles Martin style tent pegging.
T7Steve
August 31, 2023 at 12:46 pm
Good solid hitting is a plus and makes your opponent worry about the next time. Still wouldn't want to see him carted off the field. Want to beat someone at full strength and not give them excuses why we beat them.
Cheezehead72
August 31, 2023 at 07:31 am
Dude get some class. I do not like Rodgers and I believe he did what he could to bring down the Packers but to wish he gets carted off the field is something I would not wish for. You need to change your attitude.
Play at least 66% of the plays and do not make the playoffs is acceptable.
Savage57
August 31, 2023 at 07:44 am
I was going to post something for the snowflakes who'd go off the reservation over the comment needing to R-E-L-A-X, since it was just a wiseass comment on a football website venting some hate towards a guy who did my team dirty.
I won't repeat that error.
Packerpasty
August 31, 2023 at 08:26 am
calling others snowflakes tells me all I need to know about you...probably one of the 25% who thinks they are in the majority in this country..
LLCHESTY
August 31, 2023 at 03:10 pm
He looks like he's having so much fun on the Jets maybe it was MM and Gutey that did him dirty? Positively rejuvenated.
Either way, it's water under the bridge now. It was fun watching him for all these years and I wish him well.
Untylu1968
August 31, 2023 at 08:01 am
It'd be way more enjoyable for me personally if he stayed healthy and just sucked all year! Give me a top 15 pick, please, and thank you...
Bitternotsour
August 31, 2023 at 11:21 am
i'll have his tossing away his microsoft surface on a loop on my laptop...
healthy, smug, and pointing his finger. that's my hope for the year. regardless, i'm fine with the deal, and the fresh start here in GB.
Razer
August 31, 2023 at 08:25 am
Rodgers gave us many great years and kept us relevant for the playoffs. For many years he accomplished this without much of a run game, TE or great weapons. I thank him for what he did for the Packers. Yes his ego got big BUT he did pull a pretty big load. In the grand scheme we held onto him too long and he wore out his welcome. Front office made more mistakes in the end that hurt the team more than Rodgers.
coolhand
August 31, 2023 at 08:45 am
From what I have read, the Jets' O line is not that good, and they either have to run the ball a lot or ARod needs to make quick throws or he will be getting sacked or running for his life
croatpackfan
August 31, 2023 at 11:10 am
Savage57, that is why I somewhat requested not to mentioning FPQB on any topic. He is not on Packers team and I can give a sh*t how he will ended. In my mind he w/o any doubt deserves his place in Packers HOF and retiring his number.
Most of you knows my opinion on his last 7 years as Packers. I will repeat again - the moment he said that "he will never again play for Packers!" reported on the beginning of the draft before 2021. I would fulfil his wish on that first day of draft. I would call 3 worst teams and offer them him for their draft picks and more.
Packers did not do that. But at the beginning of the TC that year, after his diarrhea statement on public press con, he would be asked in half of that speach to stop and clean his locker in the locker room and to not wait the doors to hit him. And, trade him to wishing team in AFC.
Still there was more years of superb play we all enjoyed and, looking at his whole Packers career, we should pay due for so many enjoyment we had.
TKWorldWide
August 31, 2023 at 07:29 am
Regarding the safety situation:
Savage and Amos represented two very different profiles. Savage: great RAS, but, maybe not so good at…football?
Amos: experienced vet, very average RAS, but reliable and assignment sure.
GB has several safety candidates. Which profile are they? And can someone step up and seize the spot?
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 08:50 am
There are things they can do to hide that weakness at S, but they'll get exposed from time to time. They have a few guys who have started in the league, and a couple youngsters--it's a "throw it against the wall and see what sticks" kind of approach. They might be surprisingly adequate...or they might unearth a hidden gem...or we might be looking back longingly at the days of MD Jennings and wondering if he or HHCD are still in game shape.
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 09:10 am
Pass rush helps any secondary. That's a given, and we finally appear to have a pass rush. Slaton has shown a lot of improvement in push up the middle, freeing Clark up to be all the marauder he can be. Wyatt showed early improvement in TC/preseason, and I expect he will improve. The Brooks/Wooden/Cox Jr. additions, with Gary returning and Enagbare looking vastly improved should help.
Savage is a pass defender first and foremost. His numbers, while they've slipped, are equal to or better than what Budda Baker posted in earning 2 All-Pro nods. The thing is Savage has been playing FS. Pull Baker out of the slot and he's garbage in deep coverage. In a passing league, with run stop being handled up front now, Savage just may flourish.
I've been harsh on Rudy Ford, but, like Savage, Ford did bring high quality RUN STOP, having been known as a finisher with a mean streak, and a sound tackler. Ford can benefit from the added pass rush and run stop up front just like Savage. I do have a lot of confidence in Anthony Johnson Jr. making his presence felt as he learns the NFL ropes too. He comes in with more college experience than just about anybody. Both Ford and Johnson Jr. offer decent size at SS.
I agree with dobber, they're going to throw it on the wall and see what sticks this season. If things get rough, they can make adjustments before the trade deadline.
LLCHESTY
August 31, 2023 at 03:27 pm
Savage brought high quality run stop? I must have missed that play.
Cheezehead72
August 31, 2023 at 07:36 am
I do not have high hopes for the Packers this season. But I will enjoy watching them and rooting for them because we are the Green Bay Packers not the Aaron Rodgers Packers once again. I look at 5 or 6 wins because this is a young team. Now I do know that a young team can surprise you but I go with what is there. The summer of Love is over now let the games begin.
13TimeChamps
August 31, 2023 at 10:44 am
If we were playing in the AFC West or North, or even the NFC East, I could see that projection being reasonable, but not in the wide open NFC North.
Barring injuries, of course, I'd be very surprised if they only won 5 or 6 games. I don't think 8 or 9 wins is unreasonable this year.
stockholder
August 31, 2023 at 07:44 am
So nobody wants to say Jordan Love is a strength!
And our DL is.--- After 5 years of pathetic.
Why did it take Rodgers leaving, to fix what the whole NFL knew.
That championship teams stop the run and have great safeties.
Oh let's blame Capers ,Petine. and now Barry, if this doesn’t work out.
The other strengths- If it’s not All-pro capable. It’s only depth!
And I don’t want them proving themselves if a solid guy goes down.
By the time they figure it out. Age becomes the enemy.
I just can’t compare these Wrs to what worked in the past.
The biggest positional strength now is Gutey’s drafting.
MLF seat is Hot. And Guty only needs to keep changing his colors.
His revolving door has worked to perfection.
I hope Rodgers does so well, that we just eat are hearts out!
It said once a fan, always a fan. BUT- Part of the problem? BS!
If you look at the rebuild, you’ll see the truth. (Since 2010?)
The story Line is the Green Bay Packers.
So much to prove; and just enough Pass Rushers too upset.
And it just might make the beer taste Great.
Untylu1968
August 31, 2023 at 08:09 am
#1 Beer always tastes great!
#2 I hope Rodgers sucks the big D so bad
that "are" hearts are filled with the joy and bliss of a top draft pick.
#MLF isn't on the hot seat!
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 08:55 am
I agree on LaF--he's in the spotlight now, but there's no indication that he's on the hot seat.
Coldworld
August 31, 2023 at 08:53 am
“I hope Rodgers does so well, that we just eat are hearts out!”
Your obsession with Gute has you wanting the team to fail. Hardly a surprise to us here, but to say so explicitly should tell you that you are as much in the wrong place here as you think Rodgers is.
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 09:00 am
I fully expect that the former QB1 will have a very good statistical year in NY. He's got the attention he craves, he's going to want to show that he's not washed, he's got some good skill position guys to work with--he'll be motivated to be focused and play well, and moreso to look good.
That said: there are chinks in the armor of that team. He's moved to a more competitive division. Does he really have it in him to 'turn it back on' again?
Oppy
August 31, 2023 at 09:29 am
The Rodgers-led jets will be winning a lot of games. They'll probably make the playoffs. And Rodgers will be feeling himself mightily when they do.
That's when Rodgers will revert to hero ball and ultimately fail to lead his new team to a pivotal playoff win. It will come down to hubris when the chips are on the line, a key 3rd and short- whatever. He'll launch the deep ball to "his guy" in double or triple coverage where handing the rock off or taking the checkdown would have kept the chains moving.
Leopards don't change their spots, but this leopard is in a new jungle. The media won't pull any punches.
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 09:38 am
That's one scenario I agree with. The other is that Rodgers gets crumbled into a hot mess with that horrible excuse of an OL in front of him, and we get an R2. I'm betting on the latter.
TKWorldWide
August 31, 2023 at 09:52 am
Ouch.
We’ve gotta git that 65, baybay!
stockholder
August 31, 2023 at 02:03 pm
Wrong - Why keep attacking Rodgers ?
He left.
Yet- the Hate and public assassination,
keeps steam rolling.
It has always been my view, that if there is fault.
PROVE IT!
You can't dump all this on Rodgers.
If the club Keeps turning over personal.
It's only persuasive thinking.
And redirection does't work with me.
Oppy
August 31, 2023 at 03:10 pm
Rodgers was a massive problem
He's trying very, very hard to prove he wasn't a problem
You can put on a mask but not change your face
Watch what happens in NY. Already seeing the facade starting to crack.
The only redirection you're getting is Rodgers attempting to redirect the narrative on the kind of guy he is
Sorry, the guy is a POS. A really talented POS.
TXCHEESE
August 31, 2023 at 09:04 am
Man, get over the 'Packers' FO never helped Rodgers' drone. Rodgers had arguably a top 2 or 3 receiving group multiple years. Face it. He failed as miserably as anyone in the organization in the playoffs.
My hope is the Jets are just good enough to keep him playing throughout the season, but go 7-10. That should get the Pack a pretty nice 1st rounder. Would love it if Rodgers says at the end of the season he wants to continue and the Jets saying, "Uh no thank you".
jannesbjornson
August 31, 2023 at 10:43 am
Correct, move Gutedkunst and his sidekick out the door and re-boot. The 49rs are starting a 7th round pick, so Love better be a strength. He has to show he's as good as Herbert and Burrow. No more whining from the Fans and projection for front office failures to get into the Big Game.
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 12:45 pm
"The 49rs are starting a 7th round pick,"
...and of their starting 22, he's probably #22.
jannesbjornson
August 31, 2023 at 01:10 pm
He controls the ball.
Oppy
August 31, 2023 at 03:14 pm
Gutekunst knows more about scouting and player acquisition than you ever will.
You are a hobbyist, no matter how many times you have spent a weekend sitting in the stands rubbing elbows with real live professional scouts at a pro day or the scouting combine 15 years ago.
Just a reminder.
Bitternotsour
August 31, 2023 at 11:31 am
I'm happy to say that Jordan Love will be an upgrade over the Rodgers of 2022. I can't believe you don't see that. He's young, talented and hungry. He will outperform AR 2022, and he'll do it without being a dickbag.
GregC
August 31, 2023 at 08:10 am
Justin Hollins: The forgotten man. This is the second article on here in the past week that raved about our OLBs and did not mention Hollins. He's a good player, and he will be on the field more than Van Ness and Cox, at least at the beginning of the season.
LambeauPlain
August 31, 2023 at 08:42 am
Agree, and with Ford off the 53, I sense Lukas will be getting as many, or even more snaps on the DL vs edge as he adds to his bull rush. Hollins is a solid NFL player.
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 09:30 am
I agree, Greg. Overlooking Hollins could be a mistake, especially with the production he's shown in preseason with such limited reps. I think Hollins is going to be really good for this Packers team in 2023.
LambeauPlain, that is such a great point. Lukas Van Ness did find success playing on the line, and his getting those reps the last couple of weeks in TC might have sealed that deal.
I'd still prefer they add another NT, a better one than Ford, before too long. I don't like the idea of pounding 70-80 reps on a NT and expecting them to not miss a beat in the playoffs, like we've done so many times with Kenny Clark.
Coldworld
August 31, 2023 at 09:49 am
I thought Ford looked impressive. We don’t need an all star. We need depth and particularly versus the run. The fact that he is still developing and has shown an ability to disrupt—a plus not often seen in run stuffers should be plenty at this point. Barry just needs to be willing to play heavy at times. If he can’t, we will see more Eagles type losses against good running teams and a lot less Barry.
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 10:32 am
Yeah, I thought so, but, we did get gashed in the run with Ford at NT vs both NE and SEA. There's probably other stuff we are unaware of that contributed to his release.
LLCHESTY
August 31, 2023 at 03:33 pm
The two biggest runs the Seahawks had came with Brooks at 2i. He got bulldozed and the RB was off and running. Ford wasn't on the field.
LeotisHarris
August 31, 2023 at 08:24 am
"Perception makes cowards of us all." -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
Since'61
August 31, 2023 at 08:27 am
I thought that it was "Fatigue make cowards of us all". - Vince Lombardi. Thanks, Since '61
LambeauPlain
August 31, 2023 at 09:01 am
"The perception of fatigue makes cowards of us all" - Leotis Since61
Doug_In_Sandpoint
August 31, 2023 at 09:02 am
I believe it is, “Perception of fatigue makes cowards of us all.”
SicSemperTyrannis
August 31, 2023 at 01:53 pm
But what about the illusion of complexity?
Doug_In_Sandpoint
August 31, 2023 at 09:04 am
Dang LambeauPlain…you must have hit “Submit Comment” one second before me. Great minds…
LambeauPlain
August 31, 2023 at 09:53 am
Two seconds should not rob you of a thumbs up, Doug!
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 09:30 am
This was a team that was fatigued by the tension in the locker room. We'll see if that cloud has lifted, and if that breathes life into this team. The PS showing was promising.
RCPackerFan
August 31, 2023 at 08:31 am
STRENGTHS
OL -
I believe the strength of our offense is our OL. Bakhtiari, Jenkins form the best left side in the NFL. Tom looks like Jenkins 2.0.
Our OL should help allow Love to have more time. The depth is really good as well. Yosh could be a starting OT in this league with a lot of teams. Walker looked like he could be a starter. Rhyan improved maybe more then anyone from a year ago and he looked legit this preseason.
DL -
Clark is a beast. He has been basically since his rookie year. Slaton looks like he has taken a jump this year. Wyatt looks like he is also taking a jump. Wooden and Brooks looked great this preseason. They will be a huge part of the rotation.
EDGE -
Gary returning alone makes this an elite group. Smith is a great pro. He does the little things really well. Setting the Edge and whatnot. Hollins was a really good pick up last season. He has shown to be a really good rotation guy. Enagbare looks like he has taken a step in year 2. Van Ness has shown his natural power. He has a non stop motor. He will take some time, very similar to Gary, but he will be in the rotation right away. Cox as our 6th Edge player is a huge upgrade over any previous 6th OLB I can remember.
Other strengths -
RB - Jones and Dillon form perhaps the best duo in the league. Wilson looked very good in the preseason. But will take some time to develop and learn it all.
CB - We have 4 starters right now. Vallentine looks like a steal in the 7th round.
WEAKNESSES
Safety -
This one is obvious. If Savage can be the player we thought he would be, this will make it less of a weakness. But we have no clue who will be lining up next to him.
Youth/inexperience -
We have as much talent across the roster as I can remember. But we also have more inexperienced players as I can remember. This can be a good thing but also can bring some inconsistencies.
While the inexperience will definitely cause some issues along the way, it should provide a lot of good moments as well. WR for example, while everyone on the team is 1st or 2nd year players, they are fast and came make plays. TE as well. Musgrave is going to a be a weapon. However being young he will make mistakes.
Carlson and Whelan are going to have a lot of ups and downs. But we have to trust the process with them.
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 09:19 am
"We have as much talent across the roster as I can remember. But we also have more inexperienced players as I can remember."
Read somewhere that if you took ARod, Crosby, and Lewis off last year's opening roster, the Packers were the 5th youngest team in the NFL. The Packers have mostly been a young team since TT took over. Among the starters, there's no deficit of NFL experience...so I see that youth thing as a crutch more than anything else.
RCPackerFan
August 31, 2023 at 10:49 am
Yeah they definitely had a young roster. But its more about the positions that were inexperienced. The key positions they had experience at. This year those positions are all inexperienced.
Having a very young team isn't a bad thing. But there will be growing pains along the way.
MooPack
August 31, 2023 at 08:37 am
One thing is for certain, the Packers are going to be running the ball more. Let's hope that it's more than lip service from LeFleur. They are probably going to need ball control in some tight games this year.
They kept 3 backs and the 3rd was not the reliable Taylor. Instead they go with the RB(Wilson) that looks, albeit still early, like the best runner of the bunch after RB1 and 2. Perhaps forgoing a better assurance of blocking for running, although haven't seen enough yet from Wilson. I for one am glad they decided to go with Wilson. I'm more confident of no drop off in production when he comes in. I like Taylor, but this kid seems to have more juice.
The OL went heavier than expected. Not only in numbers, but girth. They got some big fellas at Tackle they want to rely on. Portents on running more? Guessing they want some injury assurances as well. Hopefully we don't see Jerry Seinfeld gritting his teeth exclaiming "Newman!"
“Don’t count all your chickens until they are hatched”
That is to say I think Love and the passing game is going to surprise a lot of people. It may take a half season to get going, but once Love and those receivers/TE's get some experience and on the same page, we could see some fireworks. Excited anticipation for this year!
GregC
August 31, 2023 at 08:49 am
I don't think they are going to run the ball any more than they did before. They are likely to see a lot of loaded boxes early in the season, and they will have to pass their way out of it. They have stocked up on WR talent, and they have a legitimate receiving threat at TE for the first time in ages, except for that one good year that Tonyan had.
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 09:23 am
Their run-rate has been pretty consistently 43-ish percent during the LaF years--and that was even when they were winning 13 games and you'd think they'd be killing clock.
Agreed, though, that opposing DCs will take their chances with Love and try to kill the run game. This will likely be a ball-control passing team early on--plenty of dumpoffs and outlets, high-percentage short and intermediate stuff.
LambeauPlain
August 31, 2023 at 10:04 am
MLF's IOC may be fully operational for the first time during his tenure. Love seems to have embraced it and your ball control passing is hand in glove with the concept, Dobber.
And as the preseason showed, the middle of the field is back on the menu.
I also believe the IOC can be as great an ally for the Infantry as the Air Force. Especially with an experienced O line and top RBs.
We could see a 50/50 offense this year. Keeping Wilson over Taylor tells me they want a dynamic runner at #3 because Taylor checks all the boxes (run, pass pro, receiving, STs). And inquiring about the other Taylor kind of reinforces the run game focus.
HawkPacker
August 31, 2023 at 08:16 pm
To me, keeping Wilson over Taylor, points to the future based on the status of our top two RB's.
LambeauPlain
August 31, 2023 at 08:38 am
"I am not going to exploit, for narrative purposes, my Team's youth and inexperience."
Tim is spot on about the spotlight on MLF and Gutey.
The talent arrow is pointing up, the experience arrow down as the youngest team in the NFL.
While the HC is now a grizzled 5 year veteran coach, he and his staff still seem to be the Rodney Dangerfields of the league...still viewed as "unproven" coaches.
When the league and its fans have low expectations, the opportunity arrow to over deliver is also pointing up. Will they be the surprise of the NFL like the young 1971 Dolphins? Will they be ridiculed like the winless 2017 Browns or 2008 Lions? Somewhere in between...but the North is wide open.
Like the man whose quote I paraphrased above, I will be optimistic.
RCPackerFan
August 31, 2023 at 08:44 am
Around the NFC North
The CHICAGO BEARS
Packers play the Bears in week 1 and then again in week 18. It will be interesting to see where each team are at both points this season.
The DETROIT LIONS
It seems most teams are all over the Lions to win the North. While they may, I can't help but to feel that last year was an overachieving year. We will see if they can play up a level or if they are going to take a step back.
The MINNESOTA VIKINGS
Vikings feel like a team that will be on the decline. Jefferson is one of the best WR's in the league. But they don't have a lot of other playmakers. Addison could be good. And Osborn is a nice player. But they have lost a lot of talent this offseason.
The North is wide open in my eyes.
Coldworld
August 31, 2023 at 09:50 am
The Lions seem to believe that they have already won it. I don’t mean fans, but the organization. It will be interesting to see how that plays out.
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 10:33 am
Detroilet?
T7Steve
August 31, 2023 at 10:52 am
Thanks for the laugh, GG.
RCPackerFan
August 31, 2023 at 11:01 am
It just seemed like the Lions overachieved last year. Maybe not. Maybe they will be really good. But I have seen a ton of people picking the Lions to win it all, and I am not entirely sure why. I get that they went 8-2 over the final 10 games last year. So that is why I guess. But I just don't see them being this juggernaut of a team.
Since'61
August 31, 2023 at 08:48 am
This roster has potential, no doubt. But Murphy and Gute have set themselves up to get through at least until Murphy's retirement in 2025. They have built themselves excuses to cover themselves with an inexperienced QB, numerous young players throughout the roster, new kicker and punter, etc.
MLF is their fall guy if things get really ugly either this season or next.
The flip side is that if everything breaks correctly for the Packers they could look like geniuses. Given the current parity in the NFC and if everything breaks correctly for the Packers they could be playoff contenders again as early as this season. They will take the Packers remaining relatively healthy and numerous young players evolving more quickly into their roles than usually expected. Specifically Love, WRs, TEs, the young DLs, the Safeties and improvement from our coaching staff.
In reviewing the Packers 2023 opponents they are not facing any juggernauts from the NFC is 2023. The NFC North is wide open, The NFC South is one of the weakest divisions in the league and their 2 remaining NFC opponents the Giants and Rams are entering 2023 with at least as many and similar questions marks as the 2023 Packers. The AFC opponents present a tougher challenge but the Packers can compete with those teams except for probably the SB Champion Chiefs.
2023 will be a season where coaching can make the difference in the Packers Won/Loss record. If MLF and Barry can get beyond being outcoached as badly as they often were in 2023 this Packers team can be in the playoff hunt. There will be mistakes by the young players both physically and mentally but hopefully the team will improve as the season progresses.
An 8 or 9 win season is not out of the question and given the state of the NFC even 8 wins may be enough to earn a playoff spot. The Packers first 5 games present an opportunity for the Packers to get off to a fast start. If they can go 4-1 or even 3-2 I think they have a decent shot at the playoffs when they return from their bye week. Staying healthy as always will be the key. Either way I'm forward to the journey. GPG! Thanks, Since '61
dobber
August 31, 2023 at 09:28 am
In a league designed to keep teams relevant as long as possible over the course of the season (read: pushing teams to 8-9 wins), you've got to be pretty good to win more than 10 and pretty lousy to lose less than 7. I don't see this as a pretty lousy team....
Since'61
August 31, 2023 at 03:47 pm
Dobber I agree. Thanks, Since '61
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 10:06 am
All good points, Since'61.
I think we stand a better chance of being surprised by the response from the coaching staff, and a freer group of players unbridled by the removal of drama and pressure to win it all now BS. That "Last Dance," stuff was tiresome garbage from the moment Rodgers uttered the words.
LaFleur finally gets to run his scheme as intended, unencumbered, with a QB1 in Jordan Love who is willing to be that "extension of the HC on the field," for LaFleur. We shouldn't forget, MLF is competitive as well, and has heard all the fan criticisms. Like yourself, I'm hopeful he adjusts accordingly, makes better game planning & in game decisions, and shows that he has learned from his mistakes. Prove it MLF.
Joe Barry has been roasted here. Few have taken the time to look at what he was actually attempting to do. There is a chance Barry's D surprises the hell out of people here this year, and here's why...
Barry ran mostly Quarters, Quarter Quarter Half and Cover 3 least season, with more Cover 1 than most teams. That probably accounts for about 80% of the defenses that he employed. He DIDN'T HAVE THE PLAYERS for it.
Let's take this a step further. If this was Barry's way of saying "LOOK, I TOLD YOU SO!" Good for him. He didn't stray from playing his scheme as designed. For all we know, that scheme may have been mandated to him. Regardless, he kept playing those coverages in spite of injury to starters. Point made?
The attrition was felt immediately in Week 9 when we lost our OLB1 and CB2, Gary & Stokes. That's just 2 players. Our depth was severely lacking, and that was readily apparent.
Gutekunst clearly took dynamic talents across the board who offered - both - PASS & RUN D strengths.
Those defenses are prized coverages when you have all the players to run them, and they work. Get a couple of injuries at key positions, WITHOUT ADEQUATE REPLACEMENTS, and teams will run all over that - which is exactly what we have witnessed these last 2 season.
We just might have a stronger D front, a deeper D front, than we've seen in Green Bay in decades.
Barry has the players now, with some decent depth up front where it counts. A lot of youth with 1st and 2nd Year players in Quay Walker, Carrington Valentine and Anthony Johnson Jr., but... Savage & Ford have seen some things. If they flourish, Jaire, Rasul & Nixon flourish, Stokes returns to perform well... things could get very, very good for this Packers team.
A lot has to go right for this 2023 team, but I can easily see them with double digit wins. If things don't work out, that will be on LaFleur. He's the one who has to respond, big time. We really need him to be his absolute best this season, and I think he will be. We'll find out soon just how competitive he is.
He's got a ton of young, talented players with chips on their shoulders, which could make 2023 surprisingly fun.
Since'61
August 31, 2023 at 01:26 pm
Good post gg. As I've posted during the preseason, contrary to so much that has been written, the pressure in 2023 is not on Love but rather it is on MLF, the coaching staff, the OL and the defense.
The coaching needs to prepare the young guys to play and teach them how to play. They need to help the youth on this team mitigate the number of mistakes they will make and they will make them. The OL needs to make the run game go or the passing game will suffer and Love will take more lumps than is necessary even for a new starting QB. Finally the defense needs to keep the team in the game so that as the offense finds its legs they don't find themselves down by 2 or more scores in the second half.
If all of that happens and the team stays relatively healthy the Packers have a shot. If not we could be looking at a 5-6 win team. Fortunately, as I pointed out in my post above the schedule should help the Packers especially given the level of parity in the NFC. If we can get to 4-1 or 3-2 at the bye week we have 12 games left and if the Packers split those 12 games they are at either 10-7 or 9-8. Either should get the Packers into the playoffs and 10-7 probably wins the NFC North. Time to enjoy the journey.
Thanks, Since '61
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 01:35 pm
Yup. The entire staff has been challenged. They remember what's been going on previously, and I'm looking forward to them blazing a new path. They're young too, for the most part. They're all super competitive.
The journey? I think it's going to be pretty damn fun.
T7Steve
August 31, 2023 at 02:07 pm
"Journey"? It'll be a Wheel In The Sky! Keep it turning!
greengold
August 31, 2023 at 02:58 pm
Don't stop believin', MF!
LOL
LFG GPG AGNFB
RCPackerFan
August 31, 2023 at 09:00 am
Storylines I’m watching in the NFL this season
"The AFC triangle of elite quarterbacks (Chiefs/Mahomes, BIlls/Allen, Bengals/Burrow) is going to be an absolute blast to watch for, hopefully, many years to come. "
The AFC is loaded with QB's. Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, Jackson, Watson, Wilson, Herbert, Rodgers. Then there are some young guys that are looking really good or could be really good. Lawrence, Tua, Pickett.
Comparing that AFC QB's to the NFC, and the AFC is much, much better.
NFC there are so many question marks. These are the starting QB's for the NFC. Desmond Ridder, Clayton Tune or Josh Dobbs, Bryce Young, Justin Fields, Dak Prescott, Jared Goff, Jordan Love, Matt Stafford, Kirk Cousins, Derek Carr, Daniel Jones, Jalen Hurts, Brock Purdy, Geno Smith, Baker Mayfield, Sam Howell.
"The quarterback situation for the 49ers is fascinating to me. With Trey Lance traded to Dallas and Jimmy Garoppolo starting in Las Vegas, the 49ers have firmly committed themselves to Brock Purdy. But Purdy is coming off a significant elbow surgery, and only has about a half year of NFL football under his belt as Mr. Irrelevant. Is he actually going to be a legitimate starting quarterback in this league? What happens if the 49ers committed to the wrong guy, or simply find out that he’s not going to be able to come back from his injury in the way they hoped?"
It will be really interesting to see how the careers of Purdy and Lance work out. Did the 49ers get it right? It would be more fun if they didn't. But either way it will be fun to see what happens.
WD
August 31, 2023 at 10:20 am
With eyes wide open this 23 Packer team looks to be one of the best teams assembled in quite some time . Excluding the QB situation there are NO weaknesses, only strengths. With QB we must suspend judgement. There is no such thing as perfect. The defense this year is going to dominate. If Love can play solid and not throw a lot of interceptions; the playoffs are more than realistic. In their hearts this team to a man is playing to win the Superbowl. As are loyal Packer Fans. Expectations are always high with the fans. And, why wouldn't they be? The Packers have more wins then any other team in the NFL. Would you rather be a Bear fan?
Thegreatreynoldo
August 31, 2023 at 11:11 am
When my optimism gets low, I look at the Packers' schedule. It is hard not to see 4 or 5 gimme games, and 5 more that look like tossups. I believe the team's record will be better than the team actually was.
On the defense, the only strength is the OLBs. Quay Walker looked better and he always could cover, but judging his run processing against vanilla offenses that aren't game planning is difficult. The Packers need him to blossom. Campbell given health will be fine. There is no depth behind them. Despite PFF grades, Eric Wilson is bad. McDuffie is an okay stop gap.
Slaton looks a bit better, but nothing that moves the needle. Wyatt looks like a better pass rusher, but not much better against the run unless he is allowed to penetrate on every play. Clark has regressed every year since 2018, and the aspect of his play that had diminished by the most over that time frame is his run defense. Brooks and Wooden impressed but mostly due to their pass rush prowess. It remains to be seen if they will hold up against the run. I don't think the Packers' long held tendencies to prefer players who have juice to defensive linemen who are stout has changed one iota. The roster games they played with Jonathan Ford just scared me about whether they have learned anything, especially considering the deadwood that was available to them.
The corners look good, but they need to be used aggressively. Nixon looks adequate in the slot, no more. The safety room looks bad.
The offense looks better, but not better than last year. Watson needs to stay healthy. I really liked Doubs, even giving him his own section in the practice roundups last year. They need him to blossom. He had 9 drops in 529 snaps last year (and those sites are lenient in their assessments). If he plays 1,000 snaps this year, he can't set a new Packers' record with 18 drops. Running the correct route and making the appropriate adjustments on the fly is imperative. Reed looks dynamic. He can be an improvement over Cobb. He seems to be a slot only WR even in the Packers' own estimation. He has too many drops, as well. Musgrave has been a big part of the offense, though the QB connection looks a little disjointed. Too many drops, but his athleticism could easily make that a minor matter. Kraft hasn't blocked as well as hoped, and he, too, has dropped too many, including one pass that hit his facemask. The RBs look good, with both of them playing for money this season. Love has persuaded me that he won't be bad. He is still a significant downgrade from even 2022 Aaron Rodgers. OTOH, Love will have his two top WRs hopefully healthy all year and ready to make second year jumps. The WR room should be better than it was in 2022 by quite a bit. The TE's should be better receivers. I know Tonyan had 53 Recs, but for just 8.9 yards/rec; that plus his blocking and inability to stretch the seam got him $2.65M. Musgrave should blow that out of the water. OL starters look good. I don't think Tom is Bulaga-good as a right tackle, but he should be a modest improvement over Nijman.
Atlanta, Carolina, LAR, and Denver and probably the Raiders really ought to produce 3 wins. Toss ups might be NO, Giants, Pittsburgh, and Tampa Bay. The north looks weak, so 3-3 seems reasonable. I think Chicago is still bad, but weird things happen during week one. 7 or 8 wins, and if things break well, 9.
splitpea1
August 31, 2023 at 11:18 am
If there's any team that can make an early statement in the NFC North, it's the Lions if they can beat the Chiefs at Arrowhead. Good luck.
Carlson: Why worry, what can you do but hope for the best? We needed a new kicker, and a little anxiety is natural when you make a change here. Gotta love the strong leg, although great consistency will obviously be required on XPs and within 45 yards.
OL: It's a strength as far as versatility goes, but there's still some sorting out to do. I'm not ready to say this unit is an "embarrassment of riches" just yet. Let's see how they do in the running game, particularly in short yardage and deep in the red zone.
T7Steve
August 31, 2023 at 11:34 am
Yes, wouldn't it be nice to run consistently in the red zone and short yardage situations?
To dictate to other teams what they'll have to TRY to do to prevent it? Rather than trying to fool them or change plays to counter what they're showing?
HarryHodag
August 31, 2023 at 11:23 am
Strengths: New attitude! Gone are the days of 'we have this in the bag' only to get smashed.
Speed: never can have enough. Bear Bryant: "Luck follows speed".
Enough veterans to compete in key positions.
Weaknesses: Youth. It could be an asset though
Injury bug. Anyone care to bet David B. doesn't make it the full year?
Cap issues holding team from making moves.
Footnote: I usually criticize the national sports media dopes but there was an interesting stat on NFL Live
yesterday. The only time the Packers had a top 5 defense in the Aaron Rodgers era was the last
time they won the Super Bowl in 2010-11. I've argued for years the problem with the Packers
wasn't the offense, it was defense and special teams. I think that is about to change.
LLCHESTY
August 31, 2023 at 03:40 pm
That's wrong, they had a top 5 defense in 2009 also.
Since'61
August 31, 2023 at 04:06 pm
Per Pro Football Reference in 2009 the Packers defense was ranked 7th in points allowed.
I'm not sure what your posted top 5 ranking in based upon. Thanks, Since '61
davekenya
August 31, 2023 at 12:36 pm
The biggest strength of the 53 man roster is the upside potential that the new talent and young players have to offer -- some we'll see this year; likely moreso in years to come.
The biggest weakness is inexperience and inconsistency that comes with that.
In a lot of ways, I see this as a new team with a new head coach...one that will be implementing lots new on offense with a new QB as (finally) MLF gets to run his schemes more freely (and likely with a QB buying into them).
This should be exciting to watch -- as it will be 'new' and we'll see both emerging stars coming out of nowhere. We likely will experience more 'frustration' as players who make great plays don't do so regularly (yet) as they haven't mastered all the nuances of day-in-day-out success and habits that lead to it (yet). We should also appreciate that teams this young have a record of not winning more than 50% of their games -- so we need to temper our W/L expectations.
There is a good foundation here. As a younger team, we should experience fewer serious injuries (true? - I'm speculating) which will mean more cohesiveness as games go by. We'll get an extra #1 or #2 draft pick next year. And our cap situation will get better. There is sunshine -- even if occasional clouds will be drifting in front of it from time to time this year.
SicSemperTyrannis
August 31, 2023 at 02:27 pm
Dave, our cap situation isn't really any better next year. 2025 I hope is a big improvement. Until then the big improvement will come from the youts improving.
Picks in the next draft aren't likely to contribute that much right away. Will need some O linemen, just to fill in as current guys age out. S as a position looks to be strong in the next draft, maybe somebody steps right in there.